Comments on Baptists Today Blogs: Job in the season of Lent

Job never made much sense to me. While a lot of p...

2008-02-26T12:32:00.000-05:00

Job never made much sense to me. While a lot of people talked about Job, I always had trouble reconciling the actions and the "speech" that God gives Job with other aspects of God's character that I've read about.

Then I heard a song by Ed Cash titled Where Were You? (The CD has the same title).

It is born out of the passages where God and Job are conversing and after a while God begins to put Job in his place (i.e. - Did you tame the oceans? Do you cause the sun to rise?) And after he has sufficiently pointed out the chasm between Himself and Job, the then reaches out and bridges that gap. Ed Cash uses these passages as a starting point and then ties in the life of Christ.

Now, when I read Job, I still have some questions regarding "why", but I'm much more comforted regarding the response of God as an expression of his love instead of a declaration of Job's puniness.

Mos,I could argue that the context and Hebrew voca...

2008-02-26T09:39:00.000-05:00

Mos,

I could argue that the context and Hebrew vocabulary make it clear that Job is talking about being vindicated rather than redeemed, but it's obvious that considering something that doesn't match your firmly set conclusions is not worthwhile.

You've made your points from your perspective. Let's leave it there.

Tony:Thanks for sharing your thoughts regarding th...

2008-02-26T09:03:00.000-05:00

Tony:
Thanks for sharing your thoughts regarding the perplexing character of Job. I tought the book many years ago when it was called the January Bible Study. A part of the study was four Sunday sermons and one I entitled: Would you be Good For Nothing? In light of the "prosperity" gospel being preached today, it reveals the underlying motivation of church goers.
Joe

Tony,You said,"I fail to see where you find that G...

2008-02-25T23:18:00.000-05:00

Tony,

You said,

"I fail to see where you find that God offered eternal life through Christ to Job, thus strengthening him."

But Job said,

"For I know that my redeemer liveth, and that he shall stand at the latter day upon the earth: and though after my skin worms destroy this body, yet in my flesh shall I see God: whom I shall see for myself, and mine eyes shall behold, and not another; though my reins be consumed within me."

You said,

"The question is not about whether we believe there are eternal rewards, but whether we would serve God even if there were not."

We cannot possibly serve God apart from a faithful response to His words. Therefore your distinction is moot. Not only so, Paul addressed that very question and answered it; not for the purpose of pious introspection, but for the purpose of showing the absurdity of Christianity apart from the promise of resurrection and subsequent eternal life. He said,

"But if there be no resurrection of the dead, then is Christ not risen; and if Christ be not risen, then is our preaching vain, and your faith is also vain."

And

"If in this life only we have hope in Christ, we are of all men most miserable."

You said,

"The question is not about the trustworthiness of God's promises, but about the motivation of our devotion."

It is impossible to separate the two. We would never serve God apart from His promise. His promises are the motivation of our devotion. As John said,

"We love him because he first loved us."

And as Paul wrote to the Roman saints,

"We are saved by hope."

So, if we had no promise of eternal life would we still serve God? The Biblical answer is, no. Job didn't do it. We wouldn't do it. No man ever did it.

However, we have no promise of material blessing in this life beyond the necessities - namely food and clothing, and that not promised in abundance. Would we serve God if we were reduced to the bare essentials? I suppose only the Lord knows that.

Mark Osgatharp
Wynne, Arkansas

Star -- While one can doubt whether Job could have...

2008-02-25T22:11:00.000-05:00

Star -- While one can doubt whether Job could have been sinless, the premise of the story is that he was "blameless and upright," and thus had done nothing to deserve the great losses that had afflicted him. Further speculation is really beside the point.

Mos -- The question I raised has nothing to do with doubting whether God has offered eternal life (though I fail to see where you find that God offered eternal life through Christ to Job, thus strengthening him). The question is not about whether we believe there are eternal rewards, but whether we would serve God even if there were not. The question is not about the trustworthiness of God's promises, but about the motivation of our devotion.

Tony,Your comments on Job's faith were headed in t...

2008-02-25T20:57:00.000-05:00

Tony,

Your comments on Job's faith were headed in the right direction until you delved into the following speculation:

"Ultimately, if we had no promise of eternal life and no assurance of a connection between spiritual devotion and physical prosperity, would we still serve God?

It's a troubling question, but one that thoughtful worshipers must ask."

Such speculation troubles only those who, in the back of their minds, are reserving the possibility that maybe the Scriptures are wrong after all.

God never promised His children earthly prosperity. Job knew that, and that is why he did not lose his faith in God when God dealt him one devastating blow after another.

God did, however, promise Job life eternal through Christ and ultimate deliverance from his earthly tribulations. The knowledge of this promise is what sustained Job through his tribulations. James points us to Job's example, assuring us that, in the end, the Lord is pitiful and of tender mercy.

It may sound pious and "thoughtful" to opine as to what we would do without God's promises. Doubtless such thoughts must trouble those who take them seriously.

Those of us who believe God's promise of eternal life are not in the least troubled by such thoughts. To us all the promises of God in Jesus Christ are, "Yes." Were it not so (I speak as a fool) we could only say with Paul that we would be, "of all men most miserable."

Mark Osgatharp
Wynne, Arkansas

Hi Dr. Cartledge,You got me thinking about Job. It...

2008-02-25T18:04:00.000-05:00

Hi Dr. Cartledge,

You got me thinking about Job. It appears that when discussing this Chapter, we are led to believe that Job was sinless, but how can that be, unless he was of divine nature, and we know he was not.

I wonder if it would have been considered as you said if he had prayed for forgiveness of whatever sin he may have committed. I thought that was a legitimate prayer for humanity today, so please correct me if you can or if I am wrong.

Yours respectfully,
star